Five minutes with Douglas Rushkoff
Douglas Rushkoff is a novelist (The Ecstasy Club is about the 1990s drugs and rave scene, and Exit Strategy deals with hacking, online business and market madness); blogger; documentary-maker (he presented The Merchants of Cool and appeared in The Persuaders); writer of many books on new media and popular culture (including Cyberia, Media Virus, Playing the Future); and appears on TV shows from NBC Nightly News to Larry King Live and Bill Maher as a commentator on trends, culture and the wired world. He lives in Brooklyn with his wife, and daughter. NZBC emailed him some questions and in a matter of hours he’d answered them all. What a gent.
NZBC: When is there going to be a film of The Ecstasy Club and has it been optioned?
DR: “It’s been optioned a few times, sometimes by big places like Miramax, other times by little places or individuals. A former student of mine has it right now, and is working on adapting it for an indie production with a company called Ghost Robot — which is probably the best way to go. There’s a queue of others in my inbox, so when one doesn’t work out, I just reply to the next one and see what they’re thinking. I always wanted to adapt it myself, but most filmmakers want to keep the author as far away as possible!”
The Ecstasy Club dealt, to a certain extent, with rave culture. Do you think this particular aspect of dance culture is dead and, if so, what do you think will replace it?
“Cultures don’t really die — they just go into remission and then reappear in a slightly new form. The problem with most rave communities is they weren’t fully conscious of the agendas underlying rave’s existence. Economics, reclamation of public space, PLUR [the rave scene mantra ‘Peace, Love, Unity, Respect’ — or, alternatively, ‘Please Let Us Rave’], etc. And PLUR came a bit too late to do any good. And, as with any drug scene, speed eventually comes in and turns love into something else. I still see rave working in more remote areas, though, and even without drugs — which is probably surprising to rave’s early enthusiasts.
“As for what’s next? I’d guess smaller gatherings. It’s the non-profit, all-are-welcome, we-don’t-need-MTV-to-do-it-for-us spirit that energised rave. And that can be done in someone’s living room or backyard. Then it gets truly radical.”
Your TV programme The Merchants of Cool examined the tactics, techniques and cultural ramifications of marketing moguls, and recently screened in New Zealand on the Arts Channel. In it you made reference to the “media feedback loop”. You say it was difficult to persuade the producers to leave this concept in the show because they feared it was too ‘abstract’. Could you give us a brief summary of what you mean by the “media feedback loop”?
“Most simply, that these networks do painstaking research to find out what kids wear or want, and then create shows that give this back to the audience. Then kids in the audience imitate what they’re seeing on MTV or, worse, ape those fashions and behaviours in order to get on MTV. So they’re just mirroring each other, exacerbating the most extreme forms.”
There doesn’t seem to be much action on your weblog. What’s the story?
“Depends what you mean by action. Today, I’m doing this interview and four or five others instead of writing something for my own blog audience. Which would you prefer?
“I don’t think blogs have to be daily things. That’s why so many of them are so crappy. Why have your writing dictated by some schedule? I don’t feel a compunction to get something up there every day. My blog is free in all ways, and the second it becomes a chore I have to fulfil is the second that it goes away.”
Can you please tell NZBC readers a little bit about your graphic novel, Club Zero-G, and also Testament, the comic book story?
“Club Zero-G was my first foray into sequential art, and for a variety of reasons — mostly economic — had to be about a quarter as long as I intended it to be. So the story got squished a bit. It asks what would happen if we all shared the same dream — but only one person was aware of it during waking hours. It actually came to me as a dream — about a rave that happened every night in a shared dream space.
“Testament is my new one. It starts in December from Vertigo. It’s showing how the Bible is still happening, and how we can begin to use the magick it teaches us to break free of fundamentalists’ and fascists’ grasp.”
How was playing the keyboard in Genesis P-Orridge’s band, PTV3? Any stage fright or did you get everything down in ‘take one’?
“Well, we just did a recording of a song I helped write — and I did manage to lay down the keyboard track in one take! I was sorry that I did, though, because the session only took a few minutes.
“Live was more fun, though. Crazy energy at a PTV show, especially from up on stage. Travelling was another story — especially now that I’ve got a little baby — so I had to surrender my post to someone else. I’ll still do some special shows and recordings, though.”
On your Mediasquatters active discussion group you talk about various topics pertaining to cyber-culture and media theory with members of the online community. How do NZBC readers join it?
“They can either join through my site, at www.rushkoff.com, or through Yahoogroups. All are welcome. It’s a pretty interesting conversation — and thankfully it’s mostly people other than me. People get great answers to questions there, too.”
If NZBC readers only read one book this year, what should it be?
“They should read more than one. But they should all read different ones.”
You do lots of speaking engagements in the US and elsewhere. Have you ever been to New Zealand and, if not, do you have any plans to come and speak here?
“Yeah, I’ve been over. More to Australia than New Zealand, but I managed to get to the Te Papa museum when it opened, to do a talk there. It freaked a lot of people out. I was explaining how storytelling can make magic things happen, and that by sitting down on the edge of the stage I could change the energy in the room. At that moment, all the lights went out and the fire alarms came on. The Maori all congratulated me afterwards on a spell well executed!
“I’d love to come back, but it’s a long, long trip from NYC. And a lot of jet fuel. That’s why we’ve got the internet, though.”
What are you working on at the moment?
“I just finished a book for businesspeople, that will hopefully get them to change their whole approach to industry. We’ll see if it works, but it’s a spell on a very high order. It’ll be available in December, and it’s called Get Back in the Box. The other main projects are Testament (the Bible-inspired comic we talked about above) and my new daughter, who is quite a handful.”
Many thanks, Douglas, and good luck with your various projects.
“Glad to oblige.”
Coming soon to NZBC: Five minutes with Toby Young.
NZBC: When is there going to be a film of The Ecstasy Club and has it been optioned?
DR: “It’s been optioned a few times, sometimes by big places like Miramax, other times by little places or individuals. A former student of mine has it right now, and is working on adapting it for an indie production with a company called Ghost Robot — which is probably the best way to go. There’s a queue of others in my inbox, so when one doesn’t work out, I just reply to the next one and see what they’re thinking. I always wanted to adapt it myself, but most filmmakers want to keep the author as far away as possible!”
The Ecstasy Club dealt, to a certain extent, with rave culture. Do you think this particular aspect of dance culture is dead and, if so, what do you think will replace it?
“Cultures don’t really die — they just go into remission and then reappear in a slightly new form. The problem with most rave communities is they weren’t fully conscious of the agendas underlying rave’s existence. Economics, reclamation of public space, PLUR [the rave scene mantra ‘Peace, Love, Unity, Respect’ — or, alternatively, ‘Please Let Us Rave’], etc. And PLUR came a bit too late to do any good. And, as with any drug scene, speed eventually comes in and turns love into something else. I still see rave working in more remote areas, though, and even without drugs — which is probably surprising to rave’s early enthusiasts.
“As for what’s next? I’d guess smaller gatherings. It’s the non-profit, all-are-welcome, we-don’t-need-MTV-to-do-it-for-us spirit that energised rave. And that can be done in someone’s living room or backyard. Then it gets truly radical.”
Your TV programme The Merchants of Cool examined the tactics, techniques and cultural ramifications of marketing moguls, and recently screened in New Zealand on the Arts Channel. In it you made reference to the “media feedback loop”. You say it was difficult to persuade the producers to leave this concept in the show because they feared it was too ‘abstract’. Could you give us a brief summary of what you mean by the “media feedback loop”?
“Most simply, that these networks do painstaking research to find out what kids wear or want, and then create shows that give this back to the audience. Then kids in the audience imitate what they’re seeing on MTV or, worse, ape those fashions and behaviours in order to get on MTV. So they’re just mirroring each other, exacerbating the most extreme forms.”
There doesn’t seem to be much action on your weblog. What’s the story?
“Depends what you mean by action. Today, I’m doing this interview and four or five others instead of writing something for my own blog audience. Which would you prefer?
“I don’t think blogs have to be daily things. That’s why so many of them are so crappy. Why have your writing dictated by some schedule? I don’t feel a compunction to get something up there every day. My blog is free in all ways, and the second it becomes a chore I have to fulfil is the second that it goes away.”
Can you please tell NZBC readers a little bit about your graphic novel, Club Zero-G, and also Testament, the comic book story?
“Club Zero-G was my first foray into sequential art, and for a variety of reasons — mostly economic — had to be about a quarter as long as I intended it to be. So the story got squished a bit. It asks what would happen if we all shared the same dream — but only one person was aware of it during waking hours. It actually came to me as a dream — about a rave that happened every night in a shared dream space.
“Testament is my new one. It starts in December from Vertigo. It’s showing how the Bible is still happening, and how we can begin to use the magick it teaches us to break free of fundamentalists’ and fascists’ grasp.”
How was playing the keyboard in Genesis P-Orridge’s band, PTV3? Any stage fright or did you get everything down in ‘take one’?
“Well, we just did a recording of a song I helped write — and I did manage to lay down the keyboard track in one take! I was sorry that I did, though, because the session only took a few minutes.
“Live was more fun, though. Crazy energy at a PTV show, especially from up on stage. Travelling was another story — especially now that I’ve got a little baby — so I had to surrender my post to someone else. I’ll still do some special shows and recordings, though.”
On your Mediasquatters active discussion group you talk about various topics pertaining to cyber-culture and media theory with members of the online community. How do NZBC readers join it?
“They can either join through my site, at www.rushkoff.com, or through Yahoogroups. All are welcome. It’s a pretty interesting conversation — and thankfully it’s mostly people other than me. People get great answers to questions there, too.”
If NZBC readers only read one book this year, what should it be?
“They should read more than one. But they should all read different ones.”
You do lots of speaking engagements in the US and elsewhere. Have you ever been to New Zealand and, if not, do you have any plans to come and speak here?
“Yeah, I’ve been over. More to Australia than New Zealand, but I managed to get to the Te Papa museum when it opened, to do a talk there. It freaked a lot of people out. I was explaining how storytelling can make magic things happen, and that by sitting down on the edge of the stage I could change the energy in the room. At that moment, all the lights went out and the fire alarms came on. The Maori all congratulated me afterwards on a spell well executed!
“I’d love to come back, but it’s a long, long trip from NYC. And a lot of jet fuel. That’s why we’ve got the internet, though.”
What are you working on at the moment?
“I just finished a book for businesspeople, that will hopefully get them to change their whole approach to industry. We’ll see if it works, but it’s a spell on a very high order. It’ll be available in December, and it’s called Get Back in the Box. The other main projects are Testament (the Bible-inspired comic we talked about above) and my new daughter, who is quite a handful.”
Many thanks, Douglas, and good luck with your various projects.
“Glad to oblige.”
Coming soon to NZBC: Five minutes with Toby Young.
2 Comments:
Plur plur, bro.
When you i.v. Toby Young ask him: why not bring Modern Review back as a blog?
Also: David Mitchell i.v. please
Likewise, Daniel, likewise.
Funnily enough, we contacted Mr Mitchell, whose wife gave birth three days ago. "I'm lost in Newbabyland for 6 months or so," says the author, so we'll have to get back to him then - although perhaps it would be more appropriate for you to interview the new baby?
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